Transcript exported from the original video version. Note that it has not been copy edited

00:00:00:15 - 00:00:32:19
Manu Calvo
Yeah. First of all, I would like to remark that what we're what we're watching there, are we what we can see here is just normal people by back using the bike as they're not identitarian cyclists, they're just normal people that are using the bike in a normal basis because it's useful and it's comfortable to use. You can see the bike lane in the center, no cars, no busses and a much, much wider pedestrian space.

00:00:32:28 - 00:00:41:14
John Simmerman
Yeah. Gosh, so lovely. Yeah. I look forward to seeing the next step in the next phase.

00:00:42:10 - 00:00:52:04
Manu Calvo
So, you know, down to. Yeah, yeah, maybe six years to do that. Yeah, that's a slow pace.

00:00:52:20 - 00:00:52:29
John Simmerman
Yeah.

00:00:53:24 - 00:00:58:02
Manu Calvo
We should be doing one of those installations every month.

00:00:58:16 - 00:01:47:01
John Simmerman
Hey, everyone, Welcome to the Active Towns Channel. I'm John Simmerman. And that was Manuel Calvo Salazar, also known as Manu. Manu is joining us for the second time here on the Active Towns podcast, But the first time on the video version of the podcast, he is from Seville in Spain. And we are going to be talking a little bit about, well, extensively about the amazing transformation which has taken place in Seville over the years, really over the last 20 years, beginning back in 2003 and then the build out of their comprehensive cycle network within eight months and really materializing in 2008, you are going to have of all with this one is a lot of

00:01:47:01 - 00:02:04:28
John Simmerman
fun and I can't wait to for you to see it. So let's dive right in. This is Manuel Calvo. Monica, thank you so much for rejoining me on the Active Towns podcast. Welcome.

00:02:04:28 - 00:02:08:09
Manu Calvo
Thank you. It's a pleasure always to be here with you.

00:02:09:06 - 00:02:36:10
John Simmerman
Yeah, I say rejoining because this is your second time on the Active Tales podcast. A couple of years ago you were on board for the audio only version. So this is special. This is a great opportunity for the video audience, the YouTube audience, and we've got some important updates for the audio only audience as well. But before we dive in all the details, man, I want you to just take a quick moment to introduce yourself to the audience.

00:02:36:12 - 00:02:37:05
John Simmerman
Who is Manu?

00:02:39:00 - 00:03:08:22
Manu Calvo
Well, Manu, I think it is a person that is worried about this. Sustainability issues would like to see a better and more sustainable society. It could be possible to be happy and, you know, happier, happier for the future for everyone. Now that means we have to be sustainable in the first place. We have to take care of Mother land, Mother Earth.

00:03:08:26 - 00:03:39:03
Manu Calvo
So I think that's the fight that we are aware are heading in the next decades. Maybe I've been fighting already for the last three decades or four. And, you know, taking into account that I'm making a living of that because I'm an urban, sustainable mobility consultant and someone that has also specialized in eco urbanism and more sustainable cities.

00:03:39:20 - 00:03:41:26
John Simmerman
And where are you based out of?

00:03:41:26 - 00:04:25:24
Manu Calvo
Yeah, I'm based in in Seville, in Spain, southwestern Spain. And we've been able to have some really great progress when we talk about cycling mobility and promoting cycling mobility all around the city. So I've been involved in that process since, well, almost 20 years ago, which is a really long time. And right now I'm working all around Spain and Latin America and other cities are trying to help local governments and people to get onto a bike and just share this happiness that everyone can experience when you are moving around by bike.

00:04:26:22 - 00:04:57:21
John Simmerman
Right? Yeah. Yeah. And for those that don't know the special story that is civil and the experience that the city went through and the cycle network, can you just kind of briefly give an overview of that and I'll, I'll actually pull up from your PowerPoint presentation, sort of the overview maps of the cycle network as it develops over time, But I'll let you kick it off and start that conversation.

00:04:57:29 - 00:05:05:00
John Simmerman
So what is it that is special about Seville as the city and the Cycle network that the evolved in emerged.

00:05:06:03 - 00:05:42:21
Manu Calvo
While Seville is in terms of human mobility, it's a thermal or city which lost cycling mobility many decades ago and we sort of gave the city or all the public space that we have in the city, almost all of it to car traffic. So we were experiencing and we are experiences experiencing all the problems that bring this, this giving of this public space to the car, to the car traffic.

00:05:42:21 - 00:06:16:08
Manu Calvo
And but 2003 to 2003, 2004, we have the opportunity to have all people in the local government and the local council that were worried about sustainable mobility and also shared the vision of having our city that were friendlier and more friendly for for cycling mobility. So they started some policies that were able to transform in this way the urban mobility of the city.

00:06:16:08 - 00:06:51:09
Manu Calvo
So we went from zero point something percent of the model share by bike made by bike to almost 7% in just three or four years. So we multiplied by a thousand those trips. We went from 7000, 2003 to 70000 trips a day in 2011, which in the record time for for cycling mobility. After that it went down because we had our local governance.

00:06:51:09 - 00:07:16:01
Manu Calvo
They were not it was not supportive for cycling mobility. And then it's a recovery and again, with other processes that are happening also in the city, in European and maybe Latin America city, also where American city or many cities around the world, we are well coming, I think the e-scooters. So we are we have more people in the cycle lanes, but not as many cyclists right now.

00:07:16:18 - 00:07:46:06
John Simmerman
Go to So and if I put a visual to the the actual cycle network as it sort of evolved over that period of time that you just mentioned, this is sort of what we looked at. So you'd mentioned 2003 and then so a couple of years later in 2005, this is all we had when it came, came to the safer all ages and abilities, facilities, cycle tracks and protected and separated facilities.

00:07:46:06 - 00:08:16:03
John Simmerman
This is all you had in 2005 and then in 2008 we really had that emerging of a complete cycle network. And as you described it to me back in 2018 when I met with you there in in Seville, is that you were poised and ready to move forward. Then the economic downturn happened and the collapse of the economy happened and there was an opportunity.

00:08:16:03 - 00:08:23:03
John Simmerman
So you had this build out. The literally that initial build out in in about eight months, is that correct?

00:08:24:21 - 00:09:12:10
Manu Calvo
Yes, that's correct. We were we planned the whole thing from 2000, 2003 to 2006 and then started working on the implementation of the network. And this is a really important concept. I always like to stop here because the the most important concept here is the network. We're not talking about cycle lanes or cycle tracks or infrastructure. We are talking about having a whole network, what we call it at that time, a basic network in the scope of Seville, the European area of Seville, the central Seville, where all of this happened, we were talking about 80 kilometers.

00:09:12:28 - 00:09:44:08
Manu Calvo
That would be maybe 50 miles of that basic network. And that was the network that made possible for everyone to grab a bike and cycle around and get from A to B So we after that, in the next five or maybe three or four years, we had what we called the second phase. So we added 40 kilometers more to the network and that's 2010.

00:09:44:28 - 00:10:30:05
Manu Calvo
And that's that drawing shows us a network of about 120 kilometers of that point. Almost every big avenue or every main avenue in the city had its cycle length placed there. And after after that, we've been expanding the network and maybe expanding also the density of the network. And we right now we can talk about 2200 kilometers of of of cycle lanes, but always a network there not or almost there are not new cycle lanes not being built that are unconnected.

00:10:30:05 - 00:11:01:29
Manu Calvo
So it's the expansion of a network. And this concept must be or is really, really the most important thing. Talking about cycling infrastructure. And also I would also say that this at least this basic network should be built fast in no more than 40 years. If it's not done like that, you know, it can happen that everything slows down and you never have enough cyclists to get around.

00:11:01:29 - 00:11:22:18
Manu Calvo
And for us, our experience in a lot of cities not working right now, what experience saying that it's important to be to go fast in the building or the implementation of the network. And I remember and remarking again the concept of the importance of this concept, the network.

00:11:23:09 - 00:11:39:03
John Simmerman
Yeah. And when we zoom in on this particular network map and everything in the center here of what I'm zooming in on, explain what that circle is right there. What does that represent?

00:11:40:13 - 00:12:16:01
Manu Calvo
That represents the historical center of the city. Seville has the third biggest historical center, and in Europe, it's about it has a diameter of about one mile or so in any direction, though it's almost a perfect circle, as you can see there. There are the streets are really narrow because it's medieval shape and Muslim period, urban tissue. So it's not possible to have any separate infrastructure in those streets.

00:12:16:28 - 00:12:40:00
John Simmerman
So and I would say I would even go even further to say that those streets are super, super narrow. As you mentioned, most of them, if I remember correctly, are cobbled streets. And so they're they're sort of slow streets. And so it's an environment where people walking frequently, people on bikes, people in car are all sharing that space.

00:12:40:00 - 00:13:00:13
John Simmerman
And it's an ultra low speed area. And I would also go so far as to say and we'll see this a little bit in the video, that then I'm going to play of the condition that existed back in 2018 is that in that circle there's also the old historic wall. Is there, too, because it was a walled city?

00:13:01:19 - 00:13:27:21
Manu Calvo
Yeah, actually, that's the historical center or the limits of the circle Center. Right now they're placed there because there used to be a wall. Exactly. Yeah. Or built by the Muslims almost a thousand years ago would just conserve some tiny pieces of that world. But the shape of the city was almost that. And it was like that for a thousand years.

00:13:28:01 - 00:14:07:09
John Simmerman
Yeah. Yeah. And it's beautiful. I'm going to just play some some video in the background because this video represents one year later. So I met you in 2018 and I was just out riding in the morning during rush hour. And so let's talk a little bit about that condition that existed in 2018. While, you know, because this is kind of a, you know, a special point in time in 2018, you all had attracted a great deal of attention because of the success of that initial build out of the the network.

00:14:07:09 - 00:14:31:17
John Simmerman
And in eventually we start talking about later on in this video about some of the things that need to be done. But go ahead and talk a little bit about the condition that we had in 2018. This sort of represents what we saw on that map in 2017, and this will set the platform for some new photos that you have of the current conditions.

00:14:31:22 - 00:14:37:10
John Simmerman
So going back to 2018, talk a little bit about what we're watching here.

00:14:37:10 - 00:15:09:02
Manu Calvo
Yeah, first of all, I would like to remark that what we're what we're watching there, are we what we can see here is just normal people by back using the bike as they're not identitarian cyclists, they're just normal people that are that are using the bike on a normal basis because it's useful and it's comfortable to use. So you see the normal gear, no special sporty stuff.

00:15:10:05 - 00:15:36:11
Manu Calvo
European bikes, you know, they could be walking, they could be driving a car or they could be getting to a bus. But in this position for them, it's useful and it's comfortable to you to use the bike to to get around. And that's that's what they do. So that's that would be the first point. The infrastructure is safe.

00:15:36:18 - 00:15:44:16
Manu Calvo
You can see you've seen already many kids on the terrace on top of the bike, so it's safe.

00:15:44:24 - 00:16:04:10
John Simmerman
To switch over to a photo over here real quick, too, because since you said that I put this photo, I pulled this photo up and then we'll it will we'll hit replay on this video. But this is my one of my favorite photos of the entire trip is right here. Yeah that is that just says it all in one one shot.

00:16:04:10 - 00:16:09:02
John Simmerman
They say a picture is worth a thousand words. So there you go. Continue.

00:16:09:02 - 00:16:31:25
Manu Calvo
Yeah, actually, I actually, you took a picture of Patrick on the Oliver. They're my friends, actually, and they're still going by bike everywhere. And. And actually, Patrice, the other mother, has moved to the outskirts of the metropolitan area, and she's using the bike in the transit right now.

00:16:32:01 - 00:16:48:05
John Simmerman
Very good. And in this shot here, we see this girl is picking up one of the bike share bikes and it's taking off. Talk a little bit about the bike share system that exists and civil. Did that when did that go in relative to the evolution of the network?

00:16:49:06 - 00:17:20:06
Manu Calvo
Just after the network. Okay. After after the basic network was built. Okay. We are talking around 2007 or 2008 if I don't remember back and what we can say is that we follow the same philosophy, know we needed a whole network of public bike stations. So right. 250 stations were placed at once. And right now the only way it's 265.

00:17:20:06 - 00:17:32:16
Manu Calvo
So it's been expanded just 15. Yeah, because it was almost 90% of the of the of the plot network was placed from the beginning. Yeah. That's also Yeah.

00:17:32:16 - 00:17:48:14
John Simmerman
I was going to say, you know, as we're rolling down this, the question that pops into my mind is who was your inspiration. You know, for building out a protected separated network.

00:17:48:14 - 00:18:27:25
Manu Calvo
Well, our the inspiration is always placed on those cities. That's been really where cycling is really developed. And it's into the urban culture, all of their mobility and livelihood in the urban space. We're talking about the Netherlands, maybe or Denmark, but actually that was the inspiration. But lots of things that we did in Seville were not a copy of the developments that these people have because we yeah, we always thought that we needed a whole network placed really fast, as I said.

00:18:28:19 - 00:18:54:10
Manu Calvo
But also we went for our bi directional model, which was really easier at that time to implement in Seville. And we were, we had a clear idea that we had to go from nothing to something in terms of cycling mobility. And it was it was not the same situation as the another answer Amsterdam or Utrecht do have there.

00:18:54:16 - 00:19:11:00
Manu Calvo
There are there figures is there is about 30% of cycling mobility on the model share of the city, which is a lot. And we are up going from from 0 to 6% and it's been stagnant from from from that point.

00:19:11:16 - 00:19:12:00
John Simmerman
You're right.

00:19:12:00 - 00:19:30:24
Manu Calvo
In six 7%. It hasn't been growing because Seville has done lots of things in terms of cycling mobility. But it's it's not a really good city for are there any other sustainable mobility measures nor policies.

00:19:31:10 - 00:19:59:21
John Simmerman
Right. And you know, we're rolling through, you know, some of these areas here where I know when we look at the the the more recent photos, we're going to see, you know, like some very nice incremental I don't even want to call it incremental, but some quantum leap improvements. But even in 2018, you were already identifying some of those future improvements.

00:19:59:21 - 00:20:00:12
John Simmerman
Is that correct?

00:20:01:27 - 00:20:41:20
Manu Calvo
Sure, we always are. Or I always thought that what we did was the beginning of something really big and lots of things could be done in order to improve all those basic stuff that we went through in 2006 and after. So for example, that piece of bike lane that you're you're seeing there has been improved a lot and it's gone from 2.2 meters wide cycle lanes to three meter wide cycle lanes, improving the capacity and the profitability of the infrastructure.

00:20:41:20 - 00:21:20:13
Manu Calvo
And we are trying to push the local government to have more improvements on the on the cycle, on the infrastructure and also are developing policies that have a broader scope in terms of sustainability and sustainable mobility, you know, regulating parking spaces and pushing or implementing or developing more transit options in growing the streets that need to be pedestrianized coming traffic into the residential areas.

00:21:20:13 - 00:21:49:00
Manu Calvo
Because we always I always thought and I'm thinking, I'm convinced of this, I'm going to say is that in the residential areas it's this strategy should be a traffic calming and not separate in traffic from I'm much rest non-motorised I mean the residential areas should be planned and calmed for people and for pedestrians and for bikes and not for traffic.

00:21:49:18 - 00:21:53:22
John Simmerman
Yeah. What are you pointing out here?

00:21:53:22 - 00:22:07:09
Manu Calvo
I'm pointing to the counters, I think. Yeah. We're not counters there and actually they are not working right now. We are trying to fix that up.

00:22:07:17 - 00:22:34:17
John Simmerman
So this is we get some audio on at this stage because you end up talking, we're writing with Clarence Akerson Jr from Street films on this particular day. And so these next couple clips, this will be a nice little look back in time. You can kind of remember what you said in 2018 and you can kind of fill us in as to two what happened and what didn't happen.

00:22:34:17 - 00:22:42:07
John Simmerman
So let's press play here. Give our our current 2023 voices a little bit of a rest. I'm going to take some water to.

00:22:43:09 - 00:22:55:27
Manu Calvo
That piece of brand new piece cycle for, you know, one the same quality that you can see from my.

00:22:55:27 - 00:23:32:04
Manu Calvo
Computer and something more space from the road space. You know, what we want here is take a different traffic one for and then give this to the sidewalk this case for the of place not in that particular place down but okay. And in other places what we've done right now or the local council has done with the bike office has done all last two years is taking that first traffic lane and improving the quality of the capacity and the comfortability of the of the network there at that particular hour.

00:23:32:05 - 00:23:47:22
Manu Calvo
A place. Why? Because that's the most crowded piece of network that we have now in the whole city. We are talking about 6000, even 7000 cyclists in an everyday basis. Yeah.

00:23:48:16 - 00:23:59:02
John Simmerman
Yeah. It's as I recall, isn't that one of the routes that's just on the exterior of the historic core for sure.

00:23:59:29 - 00:24:28:19
Manu Calvo
That's that's, that has really the role of this piece of network is essential because it connects, it connects just right up the outskirts of that street call center, all the main avenues that are coming and going forward, back and forth from and to the historical center, which is the core of the of the city. Yeah. Which could be like downtown on an American concept.

00:24:29:03 - 00:24:56:06
John Simmerman
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Absolutely. Yeah. In fact and what you continue to say here is, you know, pointing out to Clarence that, you know, currently as we were out there riding in the afternoon, it was relatively calm. There weren't very many people, you know, relatively speaking compared to when I was out there filming in the morning. And you turned and looked at me and say, remember in the morning rush hour?

00:24:56:06 - 00:25:24:25
John Simmerman
It was a lot more people. And it was. But even as we're just rolling down through here, I just I marveled at how many people were out there. And it wasn't just bikes. And like you said, it's normal people going about their day. But I also saw lots of people, you know, on rollerblades and, you know, just active mobility, sustainable mobility, getting out around and looking.

00:25:24:25 - 00:25:29:19
Manu Calvo
Out here, you know, that that can you can you go backwards a little bit?

00:25:29:19 - 00:25:42:13
John Simmerman
Yeah, I can. Yeah. You want to you want to look at that again. And I don't know if there's audio to this is going turn on. Yeah. There's no audio to this so I don't know what you're saying but go ahead narrate what, what's what we're going.

00:25:42:13 - 00:25:55:09
Manu Calvo
To start with. Yeah. The sense that we're not there there. Yeah. There's there's used to be a bus stop there and the bike lane goes around it. Yeah. And I mean just joking about that, you know. Yeah.

00:25:55:22 - 00:25:56:18
John Simmerman
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

00:25:57:00 - 00:25:59:08
Manu Calvo
Yeah, yeah. That's being fixed.

00:25:59:08 - 00:26:04:25
John Simmerman
Yeah, that's right. Because we're like, Why, Why are we doing this wiggle. Yeah.

00:26:04:26 - 00:26:11:13
Manu Calvo
There's stuff there. Yeah. And it's been fixed. So that's just as I say. Okay. I have to.

00:26:11:21 - 00:26:45:01
John Simmerman
Say that's great. Yeah. Yeah. You're like yeah, there's wiggle that makes sense. And we're going to come up to a really cool section here where we do have audio and I'll turn the audio back on and then we'll also we've got some photos that we can go to and, and look at the current condition and, and that was when we get to this one critical transit station and and in it talk about that entire interaction in the integration.

00:26:45:01 - 00:26:58:02
John Simmerman
Yeah here's some roller blades right here family out getting out getting some nice healthy activity and the talk about that integration between the cycle network and the transit system.

00:26:58:02 - 00:27:31:29
Manu Calvo
Well something that we planned on the last document that we wrote to the local government, we insisted a lot about the importance of having an alliance between the transit system and cycling because something that's really useful for transit is to get critical mass. And we always thought that cycling can help to improve that gathering of people around the bay in India.

00:27:32:14 - 00:27:49:17
Manu Calvo
The did not serve the of the all the other stations and the bus stops or the transit areas or transit stations. So we proposed to have some facilities about safe parking for bikes in the yard.

00:27:49:18 - 00:28:05:07
John Simmerman
In fact, let's let's press play on the video here because we under talking a little bit about that because you're absolutely right, One of the things that the Dutch and the Danes would do quite well is bike parking facilities at transit nodes and transit hubs. So let's take a listen.

00:28:05:09 - 00:28:32:17
Manu Calvo
This is an bernado transit hub. You have train, subway busses, public bikes and on the tram. So where were we? Where are we going to get here in maybe some months? Our safe parking facility here for bikes instead of this? Yeah, you can. You can show. And right now, John, the pictures just dropped.

00:28:33:05 - 00:28:49:28
John Simmerman
Yeah. So let's take a look at those photos that we now have of that, because that's, you know, that's pretty cool. I mean, you you were talking about this in 2018 and saying, you know, hey, we're going to have this and, you know, and boom, it happened. Imagine that.

00:28:50:29 - 00:28:57:18
Manu Calvo
Yeah. But since it's it's not I mean, that picture was taken before the opening of the.

00:28:57:18 - 00:29:00:23
John Simmerman
FDA is going to say there's there's construction equipment still in there.

00:29:00:23 - 00:29:30:29
Manu Calvo
Yeah. Yeah. And, and but we are we are facing a problem is management in here because it's not safe parking it's not sort of integrated into the transit system. Okay. So it's not it's not managed by a transportation and business or anything like that or a company. And I see that would be the the most well, the best solution for that because it's not it's not being successful at the moment.

00:29:31:09 - 00:30:13:19
Manu Calvo
You can see bikes outside, but it's not it has 250 places, right. So maybe ten or 15% of its capacity right now every day. So it should be the management of the facility should be improved. I would say now, right now we are trying to to our to get better, but we we need to fix problems that show up because it's it's uncharted or uncharted places and territory here trying to improve cycling in the city which is not I'm sure on our cities that we are.

00:30:13:19 - 00:30:15:25
Manu Calvo
And what we have in mind right now.

00:30:16:12 - 00:30:36:16
John Simmerman
Yeah, yeah. I popped over to the to to to this slide here real quick because we did point to that counter. You said that the counter is not currently working, but it is important to to know that, you know, you do have some data estimates. You do some data collection. And I think that's important to the telling the story as well.

00:30:36:23 - 00:30:39:07
John Simmerman
So why don't you walk us through what we're looking at here?

00:30:40:18 - 00:31:11:05
Manu Calvo
Yeah, that's the counting that we've been may making from the beginning. You can see the growing of the of the bike trips. Sorry, it's in Spanish. It's the title, it says estimated bike trips or cycling trips. That's a working day. And from 2006 you can see the level of cycling trips and they growing till 2011 you have in blue is just bikes and the orange.

00:31:11:05 - 00:31:53:04
Manu Calvo
What you have is e-scooters. That's the Spanish word for opportunity. Hmm. Yeah. And what you can see, that's a phenomenon that it's occurring also in other cities and especially in Spain, and maybe a trend in cities that we have more and more e-scooters as you can see there from yeah, from 2019, they've been growing a lot. And some of the people there that used to use the bike is changing to the to the E-scooters sure made in Seville, especially in Spain in the cities that do have a cycling network, the E-scooters use the cycle lanes for traveling and getting them around.

00:31:53:04 - 00:32:23:17
Manu Calvo
So actually they are all of them. Cyclists and E-scooter users are bike link users. So if you swap both of them right now we are having more than 80,000 trips on that infrastructure and we are having problems with the capacity of the infrastructure in Rush hour. So that's something that is pushing I think for politically also for the improving of the network.

00:32:23:28 - 00:32:38:07
Manu Calvo
But you know, it's something that's happening and it's we are also facing problems of, you know, living together, using together with the same network or the same infrastructure, the cyclists and the e-scooter users.

00:32:38:26 - 00:32:59:14
John Simmerman
Yeah, yeah. And I fast forwarded over to this part because you mentioned capacity right there. So I thought they what a great little clip to show for the capacity because a little bit further on from this we do have some current photos and we'll we'll we'll click on to that and take a look at that in your PDF that you sent over.

00:33:00:06 - 00:33:28:02
John Simmerman
But I'm going to press play here and we'll we'll listen to what you were saying in 2018 about this little niggle here, because it went through a couple of different iterations, even before this particular photo or this particular video. So let's take a listen to two Manu and John from 2018 here. This part is actually been rebuilt three times now and we want to make it known to time.

00:33:28:08 - 00:33:31:17
John Simmerman
Yeah, two times, twice now. Three times.

00:33:31:17 - 00:33:47:14
Manu Calvo
And the only one now is to get those three meters. Now. Yeah. It's a bit to get the bus to the bustling. Got it. Okay. Yeah. You can transport the whole transpose the whole following to the first traffic lane. Right. So having just two lanes of traffic.

00:33:47:27 - 00:34:07:28
John Simmerman
That's the reason why, why I wanted to play that is because. Yeah. You, you did it, you literally, you said that's what you wanted to do and in fact that's, that is what eventually happened. How, how long ago did that did that take place in the summer?

00:34:08:12 - 00:34:36:08
Manu Calvo
Yeah. It's the working activity. It's been happening for ten months and in summer. Yeah. It was opened again via the new bike lane there. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You can see it there. The, the, the row of pictures that you're out there in the bottom of the, of the slide. You can see the situation before the network.

00:34:36:27 - 00:34:37:05
John Simmerman
Yeah.

00:34:37:26 - 00:34:58:16
Manu Calvo
Via the net and the bike lane that was built on a gross space but at sidewalk level. Yeah. Yeah. Using road space level. Yeah. And the third picture right now it's the road platform. Yeah. And also road space and.

00:34:58:19 - 00:35:16:19
John Simmerman
And so the reference also. Yeah. Look at that. So, so what that also does to your, your point is you also made more space available for the pedestrian realm to true. And yeah, each point is much much better.

00:35:17:04 - 00:35:19:21
Manu Calvo
So you have the the the reference there is the tree.

00:35:20:04 - 00:35:21:19
John Simmerman
Is the tree. Yeah yeah, yeah.

00:35:21:19 - 00:35:27:16
Manu Calvo
Exactly. You see the tree. It has not moved in 15 years.

00:35:27:20 - 00:35:31:15
John Simmerman
Has not.

00:35:31:15 - 00:36:13:02
Manu Calvo
And I'm on the top of the app of the slide. You can see also another point of the network and it's been the same methodology there. We took road space with a bike lane, a sidewalk level and and the third round or the second refers for punishment of the area. We have a wider with more capacity bike lane at road always with separated from the car traffic and that area that was a what level has been placed for and that the pedestrians and pedestrian use.

00:36:13:19 - 00:36:43:25
John Simmerman
Fantastic. Yeah that's fantastic. It's it's so wonderful to see that evolution and that takes place and you know as a reminder I mean in 2003 in 2005, you know, we this was sort of like the dream and, you know, it it went through those stages. And you you went from, though, virtually nothing building it out 28, 28, 2010, 2017.

00:36:44:02 - 00:37:14:08
John Simmerman
And now what you're really doing, too, is going back in and enhancing what is existing in in 20, 2017, 2018. And really fine tuning. And again, what we're talking about, what were some of the visuals that we just had were in that ring right there around? The the most busy areas of that network is just extraordinary to see.

00:37:14:19 - 00:37:47:14
John Simmerman
And I do believe I'm and I'm convinced it's just a matter of time as you continue to fine tune and you get more support because as you mentioned, the administrative support, the government support comes and goes. And so the politics of the matter, you know, kind of infiltrate into the support of it. But the fact that you're able to keep it on the ground, enhance it and make it better, I believe that over time it will do.

00:37:47:14 - 00:38:11:17
John Simmerman
You're going to hit another inflection point and you'll get you'll see a bump up in the number of people doing it, especially since you see, as you mentioned, you're seeing more and more just normal people, especially who I would say are your your indicator species you're seeing in women and children out there doing it. That's that's the critical part.

00:38:12:13 - 00:39:04:09
Manu Calvo
Yeah. I think that's that is one of the major lessons that we can have from happening civil that actually when you make it useful and you make it comfortable, people just respond and use the infrastructure and get the bike into their daily mobility equation. It's an option that they can they can grab and use. Yeah, I think the step that is not happening is that actually this is not a free market or should not be a free market where you can place in the same table, in the same conditions, car, transit, walk or cycle.

00:39:04:09 - 00:39:55:09
Manu Calvo
And then you choose because actually on that equation you have like for things that you can use. But one of them is really bad for, for the future. So yeah, the only powers and the government know that people have to be aware that this up there are better options and these options should be improved and supported by the local governments or the national governments or any government that are seeking to have that sustainable mobility that I think that would be one of the lessons that we can also get from the civil experience.

00:39:55:09 - 00:40:28:12
Manu Calvo
Because you get great infrastructure, you get normal people to use the bike, but you don't and do not get more than six or seven or maybe 10% of the people cycling actually, because yeah, you need restrictions for car traffic, especially the possibility to park. And we do know that that would be the the main that may not it's not being pushed at the moment the expectation to park on the destination.

00:40:28:22 - 00:41:03:01
John Simmerman
Yeah. And I went back to this photo here and zoomed in just a little bit so that we can highlight something that's critical to that evolution that took place with this network and with this particular portion of the network, is that, yes, we did take away some a lane. We were able to move that over. So it has been that incremental sort of step process of encroaching upon what used to be either car parking or car motor vehicle travel lanes.

00:41:03:25 - 00:41:40:12
John Simmerman
And to your point, at some point in time, yes, you've got you're you're safe in inviting protected all ages and abilities, cycle network in place. That's great. But you also need to follow that up with other incent tives and or friction points to to to to really incentivize people more people beyond that 7% as you mentioned to make that trip that inherently rideable trip be a sustainable mode versus an unsustainable mode.

00:41:40:17 - 00:42:26:28
John Simmerman
And what I like about this photo is we see a little bit of it all. We see, you know, some trucks and some vans and some busses. The person on the bike and we see some, you know, private automobiles, you know, in there as well. And so whatever we can do to shift more of those trips onto the bikes, maybe even get some of those van deliveries to be done through cycle logistics, cargo, bike, logistics and and then shift away from, you know, those inherently unsustainable modes that, you know, make those heat waves even worse because, you know, that's something that we do recognize because, by the way, folks, civil this is a hot place.

00:42:27:12 - 00:42:39:18
John Simmerman
When I was there, it was in June, and I'll probably be back there in June again. So I don't know why I'm torturing myself. But yeah, I mean, it gets it gets hot in the summertime. So it is a place.

00:42:39:23 - 00:42:40:12
Manu Calvo
Where people will.

00:42:40:12 - 00:42:41:04
John Simmerman
Ride. Yeah.

00:42:41:16 - 00:43:10:15
Manu Calvo
Yeah. We did never think that people were going to use that bike in the summertime, but but they do know as much in springtime that they do. So yeah, because the this video was shoot was shot maybe in June time. Right. In the month of June. Yeah. And you see how many bikes are there so Yeah. Yeah it's, it's something amazing.

00:43:11:01 - 00:43:34:16
John Simmerman
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And there's a personal scooter that went by now this video, I'm going to just go ahead and let it play up to this point right here. And we don't need to turn the volume up on this. You're basically just telling me about this particular installation. And at the time in 2018, this installation had only been in about 3 to 4 months.

00:43:34:24 - 00:43:38:13
John Simmerman
Once you give the story behind what we're looking at here.

00:43:39:21 - 00:44:10:01
Manu Calvo
We're looking at the the displays are just placed in front of school and center or a school in primary school. That's the door of the of the school. And we did have problems. And I'm talking first person because I was my children went to this used to go used to go to this school. So we we did have problems of space the the walking space on the standing display.

00:44:10:10 - 00:44:41:19
Manu Calvo
A space was really, really narrow. And we talked to the local government. Now they're to have this installation here with tactical urbanism and just bollards and painting, you know, the two increment it and grow this space for walking almost, almost double the area. And it was really cheap, really fast to do and it was really convenient because actually you can see that woman is standing up, there used to be parking space.

00:44:42:29 - 00:45:14:04
Manu Calvo
So we also those trees, those two trees, they are much bigger now and they are providing the people more shade, especially in the summertime. Yeah, and it's working pretty well. We are we are in the in my consultancy we've been making for some projects for other cities following that it's about same methodology and that philosophy and it's it's been really successful at the moment.

00:45:14:04 - 00:45:29:18
John Simmerman
Yeah, Yeah, that's fantastic. And when we were focused on this particular image here, you were, you were talking a little bit about how the expanding of the pedestrian space was achieved. Looking forward into this area.

00:45:29:18 - 00:45:33:25
Manu Calvo
Here, you can see that that girl walking, that used to be a parking lane.

00:45:34:13 - 00:45:34:22
John Simmerman
Yeah.

00:45:35:21 - 00:45:45:11
Manu Calvo
Yeah. And the sidewalk was expanded and you can see the old sidewalk and the new sidewalk there just and the people just walking in the new one. Yeah. So it's.

00:45:46:11 - 00:45:57:07
John Simmerman
Yeah, yeah. And what's neat about this particular portion of the video is it's the only portion of the video where we're actually inside the historic core. Is that correct?

00:45:58:00 - 00:46:07:17
Manu Calvo
Yeah, yeah, yeah. And something that's being also down right now is that the petition translations. I don't know if that were exists in a Yeah.

00:46:07:17 - 00:46:09:13
John Simmerman
Yeah. Pedestrianization. Yeah. Yeah.

00:46:09:19 - 00:46:38:21
Manu Calvo
This translations are taking place outside the circle center. Uh, from, from a political point of view, pedestrian crossing places into the historical site is much easier. Yeah, because people understand that, you know, it's history and historical stuff and that should be saved from the pollution coming from the cars and the dirtiness of the atmospheric emissions of the cars.

00:46:39:10 - 00:47:05:25
Manu Calvo
Right. It's and not that much easy to convince people that pedestrianize should be also placed outside the historical center. But it's happening also. It's also happening. There's a piece of the shooting. We're riding along an avenue that it's being Pedestrianized six months ago know right now.

00:47:05:25 - 00:47:12:05
John Simmerman
And in fact, I want to show that show this particular photo that you sent through. I want you. Yeah. Is this kind of what you're talking about, right?

00:47:13:04 - 00:47:41:14
Manu Calvo
That it's it's you know, you can see there the plastic wrap fear of the crowd, the light of the lights. It's now being opened. Well, it's it's opened right now. But when I took the pictures, it wasn't opened yet. District. You can see the bike lane in the center. No cars, no busses and a much, much wider pedestrian space.

00:47:41:23 - 00:47:50:09
John Simmerman
Yeah. Gosh. So lovely. Yeah. I look forward to seeing the next step in the next phase.

00:47:51:04 - 00:48:01:00
Manu Calvo
So you know John, it's. Yeah, yeah. Maybe six years to do that. Yeah, that's a slow pace.

00:48:01:15 - 00:48:01:24
John Simmerman
Yeah.

00:48:02:18 - 00:48:06:28
Manu Calvo
We should be doing one of those installations every month.

00:48:07:17 - 00:48:09:02
John Simmerman
Yeah.

00:48:09:02 - 00:48:13:24
Manu Calvo
But it's taking out thinking out six months, six years to do that.

00:48:15:13 - 00:48:18:06
John Simmerman
What do we got going on here.

00:48:18:06 - 00:48:30:29
Manu Calvo
Well, that's a parking installation. That's, that's not permanent installation. That's always a only a place for events. So special events, concerts.

00:48:30:29 - 00:48:32:10
John Simmerman
Special event parking. Yeah.

00:48:32:10 - 00:48:50:12
Manu Calvo
Yeah. Yes. And it's really convenient. Really. And expensive to build and to, to, to place and to store also because it's been designed, you know, there are to, to a store it really easily and it may maybe that parking is there for two days.

00:48:51:04 - 00:49:19:04
John Simmerman
Yeah. What I love about that money is that you know this is the type of thing that doesn't cost a lot of money, but it helps support behavior change. It helps, you know, reinforce that, hey, if you're going to that event, don't go through the hassle again. It's incentivize people to be able to do change their behavior. And so, yeah, maybe there's friction, maybe driving a car to that event is really not made convenient.

00:49:19:13 - 00:49:30:04
John Simmerman
But guess what? We're going to have, you know, some pop up parking to to incentivize and make make it less make it friction less for you to take your private bike.

00:49:30:21 - 00:50:15:11
Manu Calvo
So. Yeah. And what and what is and what is the best. It's full of bikes You can you can look at the bikes also are locked not to the parking facilities or to the traffic signals or whatever because you know it's there is no place left places left on that facility so that. Yeah. And but again, John, I would say that we don't need a lot of money to do this right and if this in the infrastructure investment concepts you know making or building a highway we're talking about two or three zeros to the investment.

00:50:15:11 - 00:50:46:27
Manu Calvo
But if we talk about cycling infrastructure, it's so much cheaper. Yeah, it's it doesn't even deserve a discussion. Yeah, it's not a it's not a matter of money. It's not a matter of costs a lot of time. It's a matter of political will and that the people understand that we need to do this and it's actually we're going to have better lives and happier lives if we do it.

00:50:47:00 - 00:50:52:07
Manu Calvo
If we do, it could be it could be the opposite. I mean, we are like in this this stuff.

00:50:53:27 - 00:51:02:17
John Simmerman
And as you as is pointed out, it always seems impossible until it's done. Nelson Mandela.

00:51:02:17 - 00:51:16:19
Manu Calvo
Just imagine like the Lennon song, imagine another situation and that just go for it. And it's possible because actually the end result is better.

00:51:17:11 - 00:51:40:14
John Simmerman
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Absolutely. So based on where this journey has come now over all of these these years from 2003 to where we're at now, 20 years later, what does the future hold for civil and what are you working on currently?

00:51:40:14 - 00:52:23:06
Manu Calvo
Well, I'm trying to apply the same these same things all around the globe and also trying to make cycling policies or integrate these cycling policies into wider why there is scope or taking into account sustainable mobility. So trying to work cycling and walkability and retaking public space or even public space, you know, to have better cities or improving transit or make this alliance between transit and active mobility a reality.

00:52:24:13 - 00:52:56:09
Manu Calvo
And I'm working on that and focused on that kind of stuff, fighting a lot. But I'm convinced that the events that we are going to have to face in the coming decades, all this stuff, it should be clear or is it going to be clear that we need to go for it and that's going to happen no matter even who is in government, because we we are it's going to be compulsory.

00:52:57:12 - 00:53:03:07
Manu Calvo
It's it's a matter also of economic strategy. I think.

00:53:03:07 - 00:53:10:17
John Simmerman
And what better way to to close the South and to to with a declaration be happy cycling and walking.

00:53:11:05 - 00:53:30:09
Manu Calvo
Yeah, sure. And as I said before, we are lucky because if you're cycling you walk, you're going to be happier and but imagine it wouldn't be the case. But it's the case. We are lucky. Yeah. If you're cycling walk, you're going to be happier. So go for it.

00:53:30:26 - 00:53:55:09
John Simmerman
Yeah. Yeah I love it. I love it. Monica, thank you so very much. I can't wait to visit you again and see some of those enhancements and one of the great things about going back to a place, you know, years later after improvements have been made is being able to do just like you have with those side by side by side photos, those three panels.

00:53:56:00 - 00:54:18:21
John Simmerman
I love nothing more than to roll down those same streets and shoot video So you can have like the side by side of what that experience is. I can't wait to to see it. So keeping my fingers crossed that I can make that trip happen in June again, I don't know why I keep going in June. I tried to make it happen in April, but it doesn't seem to be well together.

00:54:18:22 - 00:54:23:18
Manu Calvo
You know, October and November should be also a good months to come here to help.

00:54:24:08 - 00:54:41:25
John Simmerman
Well, I will I will say this I will say this about June in Seville. I love the jacaranda trees because they're in their in bloom and the purple lavender everywhere is just so photogenic and so beautiful. So there is that. Yeah.

00:54:41:25 - 00:55:03:22
Manu Calvo
Okay. As always, John, thanks a lot for having me here. It's always a pleasure to share with you any time. Talking about some great issues and some very important things. And of course, you you will be really, really welcome here in Seville at home and bring with you whoever you want.

00:55:04:29 - 00:55:09:21
John Simmerman
And thanks again. Thank you so very much money for for this opportunity to reconnect.

00:55:10:16 - 00:55:13:01
Manu Calvo
Thanks. Stay down. Always a pleasure. We try it off. Yes.

00:55:13:17 - 00:55:36:09
John Simmerman
Hey, thank you all so much for tuning in and hope you enjoyed this episode with money. Please put a thumbs up. Leave a comment down below. And most importantly, please share it with a friend and spread the word about what is entirely possible if we have the political will and the courage to do something different and break out of the status quo, we will again all have another episode next week.

00:55:36:09 - 00:56:00:20
John Simmerman
And until then, this is John signing off. I wish you much activity, health and happiness. Cheers. And again sending a huge thank you to all my active tones. Ambassadors supporting the channel on Patron. Buy me a coffee YouTube super. Thanks. As well as making contributions to the nonprofit and purchasing things from the active town store, every little bit adds up and it's appreciated.

00:56:01:00 - 00:56:10:04
John Simmerman
Thank you all so much.